|
Post by azdesertrhino on Sept 25, 2006 7:18:04 GMT -5
I receive a e-mail digest from a group called "Arizona Back Country". This is one of the posts in the digest I received this morning. This group boasts 555 members and not one person has signed up to help with this project. Note in the post the person says AZVJC has 4 people signed up. VJC boasts 2,336 members. Now I know not all of them are local but 4 people out of over 2,000 is disgusting. These are the same people that will be screaming the loudest when our trails are closed. Always remember one thing, the "greenies" are well funded, very vocal and there are a lot of them. I know it's a PITA to take time from our families or our fun time or our projects at home to work on something that most of us will never use but we need to build a relationship with the BLM and it needs to be a positive relationship. I'm glad to see we, as a small group, compared to the other 2 groups mentioned above, we have 7 folks committed to helping out with this project. I really think more of us should take the 1/2 a day and make a showing at this important project. We show 80 registered members and I think 99% percent are local. I know some folks have prior commitments, I also know some of us canceled a real nice trail run to volunteer for this project. I guess it all boils down to "How important are your trails to you?" In the big picture, this is where the rubber meets the road. I'll get off my soapbox now! 2a. BLM Volunteer Project/Clean up for 9-30-06 Posted by: "SteelPonyCowboy@aol.com" SteelPonyCowboy@aol.com cowboy_75az Date: Sun Sep 24, 2006 4:55 pm (PDT) I am surprised that NO one has signed up for this yet. It is an important project that is an investment in the future of OHV. The interest in this project shows the BLM just how much we are interested in taking care of the trails and the reason the trails are there. I dont see any "fun" trail rides scheduled for the same day so how about some of you healthy and strong young guys sign up and give a hand ! Looking forward to your support....... p.s. the VJC has 4 signed up, want to see if we can beat them ? Looking forward to your support ! Mike
|
|
|
Post by 7Lbar on Sept 25, 2006 11:10:47 GMT -5
I didn't see where you could sign up on AZVJC, the old or new site. It was mentioned on the old site but you could not click it to add yourself like the other trail runs. Oh well, the four of us that are VJC members, are flying under the TOR flag for this project.
|
|
|
Post by azdesertrhino on Sept 26, 2006 20:08:09 GMT -5
Pretty pitiful is all I can say. I thought people were comitted to working with the people that control whether our trails stay open or not. I guess that only counts if it's sitting behind a computer. There are thousands of wheelers in Arizona and there are 10 freakin' voluteers willing to take 4 or 5 hours of time to help? Another post below regarding the project. Looks like our small group will be supplying most of the labor. It would be awesome if TOR could come up with the 20 volunteers they originally wanted! Is it really that much to ask? We are all willing to drop everything at a moments notice to help out a fellow wheeler. Is this really any different? From: SteelPonyCowboy@aol.com >To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [az_vjc] Volunteer Project Saturday morning 9-30-06 Florence Jct >Area >Date: Sun, 24 Sep 2006 19:38:25 EDT > >Looks like we have two definite and two maybes for this BLM volunteer >project. I talked with Francisco this past week, they have 10+ >volunteers from >other sources and the project is a definiete go. > >I feel kind of embarrassed , and somewhat discouraged, that the most we >could >sign up for this event is 2 people for sure and two maybes. If you are a >maybe and are definetly going, please change your status in the Trips >section >to definite. If you were waiting until the last minute to decide if you >could do this, please sign up now. > >I know, this is too much like work and you would rather be out wheeling but >this is an investment in the future of our recreational hobby. I have a >heart condition and shouldnt be doing this kind of stuff but it is that >important >to me to do my part to show my support which I hope in the long run will >contribute to keeping the trails open. I will be out there helping to >dig >holes, mix concrete and "plant" signs. How about some of you young guys >take about >4 hours of your time to help out with the harder work building that walkway >so that people who arent as young and full of energy can get to the >petroglyphs >easier ? > >I am giving the FINAL number to Francisco on Wednesday. > >Thanks ! > >
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 26, 2006 20:18:26 GMT -5
Pretty pitiful is all I can say. I thought people were comitted to working with the people that control whether our trails stay open or not. I guess that only counts if it's sitting behind a computer. There are thousands of wheelers in Arizona and there are 10 freakin' voluteers willing to take 4 or 5 hours of time to help? Another post below regarding the project. Looks like our small group will be supplying most of the labor. It would be awesome if TOR could come up with the 20 volunteers they originally wanted! Is it really that much to ask? We are all willing to drop everything at a moments notice to help out a fellow wheeler. Is this really any different? From: SteelPonyCowboy@aol.com >To: az_vjc@yahoogroups.com >Subject: [az_vjc] Volunteer Project Saturday morning 9-30-06 Florence Jct >Area >Date: Sun, 24 Sep 2006 19:38:25 EDT > >Looks like we have two definite and two maybes for this BLM volunteer >project. I talked with Francisco this past week, they have 10+ >volunteers from >other sources and the project is a definiete go. > >I feel kind of embarrassed , and somewhat discouraged, that the most we >could >sign up for this event is 2 people for sure and two maybes. If you are a >maybe and are definetly going, please change your status in the Trips >section >to definite. If you were waiting until the last minute to decide if you >could do this, please sign up now. > >I know, this is too much like work and you would rather be out wheeling but >this is an investment in the future of our recreational hobby. I have a >heart condition and shouldnt be doing this kind of stuff but it is that >important >to me to do my part to show my support which I hope in the long run will >contribute to keeping the trails open. I will be out there helping to >dig >holes, mix concrete and "plant" signs. How about some of you young guys >take about >4 hours of your time to help out with the harder work building that walkway >so that people who arent as young and full of energy can get to the >petroglyphs >easier ? > >I am giving the FINAL number to Francisco on Wednesday. > >Thanks ! > > Jim, I clearly understand what your saying, but just to put something into perspective... TOR currently has 15 active members, and out of 15, we have 8 volunteers for this work day. Thats what...roughly 60% of TOR? I'd love to be able to show up with 20 members at the work site, but the bottom line is that we don't even have 20 members yet.... I'd like to see more participation, and hopefully in the future projects/cleanups/work days, we will get more participation.... I too will be sending our final numbers to Fransisco tomorrow afternoon. I'm hoping that by then we have one or two more volunteers....
|
|
|
Post by azdesertrhino on Sept 26, 2006 21:52:56 GMT -5
That's the problem with writing on the INTERNET. Sometimes the point gets lost and I guess the way I placed my wording and punctuation didn't help.
I think it's awesome that our small group of members is volunteering the lions share of the labor. It shows a real commitment by our members.
It would be awesome if we had the numbers to turn out 20 volunteers. It would set an example to the other clubs. They're commitment is lacking.
The rant was meant in general about the thousands of members of VJC, AZXJ, AZ Back country that aren't willing to help.
I'm sorry if my wording and punctuation gave the wrong impression. I am happy to be associated with a group that has a better than 50% turn out for a volunteer project.
|
|
|
Post by 99frontierxe on Sept 26, 2006 22:20:16 GMT -5
I knew there was something I was supposed to do this weekend that kept me from commiting to this project.... what was it again... thinkin, thinkin... oh yeah, MY WEDDING!
If this little neusance that I have going on that day wasn't happening, I believe I would have made plans to help with this. I have been doing trail repairs and cleanups ever since I decided wheeling was what I wanted. I am with another 4wd club in Phoenix, and we have adopted a trail, and provide routine maintenance on said trail... let alone in the dead of the AZ summer, you will see me at Bartlett Lake, picking up everyone else's trash in the coves.
I achieved my Eagle Scout rank, and have commited 1000's of hours to trail repairs/cleanups/community service.
After re-reading your last post, I know you are referring to the "1000s of other 4 wheelers," and is not directed to this board, in particular. However, I couldn't help but take a little offense to your original posts.
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 26, 2006 22:33:45 GMT -5
I knew there was something I was supposed to do this weekend that kept me from commiting to this project.... what was it again... thinkin, thinkin... oh yeah, MY WEDDING! If this little neusance that I have going on that day wasn't happening, I believe I would have made plans to help with this. I have been doing trail repairs and cleanups ever since I decided wheeling was what I wanted. I am with another 4wd club in Phoenix, and we have adopted a trail, and provide routine maintenance on said trail... let alone in the dead of the AZ summer, you will see me at Bartlett Lake, picking up everyone else's trash in the coves. I achieved my Eagle Scout rank, and have commited 1000's of hours to trail repairs/cleanups/community service. After re-reading your last post, I know you are referring to the "1000s of other 4 wheelers," and is not directed to this board, in particular. However, I couldn't help but take a little offense to your original posts. C'mon...your wedding isn't THAT important is it? lol (P.S. I know your future wife already hates me lol) Glad to know there is another eagle scout on the board...
|
|
|
Post by ecameron87 on Sept 26, 2006 22:49:47 GMT -5
Eagle scout here as well. I also am taking a little bit of offense here. You sound like nothing we do over the weekend is important. I wish that I had time to work on "something that most of us will never use." I also wish I also had more time to go on more runs with you guys, but I can't. I am a scout leader as well and we can use a good service project, but this weekend happens to be a big weekend for my church and I am tied up there. I am also an asst. coach for my son's soccer team. That takes up my Saturdays now as well. The point is, some of us put in a lot of volunteer work besides this BLM project, we don't sit around staring at our rigs all weekend ;D
This is also a reason I don't want to be an officer yet for this club, but I really want to join! (My wife thinks I have already bitten off more than I can chew)
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 26, 2006 22:51:59 GMT -5
I know Jim personally and I REALLY DONT THINK he meant any offense by his post...It's like he said, sometimes, things written on a forum can me taken a thousand different ways...
I think he understands that TOR is doing everything it can... I know we all have commitments....hell, you know how long it took my wife to keep me home for a weekend...and I STILL WENT OUT...lol My weekends are busier than my weeks...lol
|
|
|
Post by K5 on Sept 27, 2006 0:05:07 GMT -5
I know Jim personally and I REALLY DONT THINK he meant any offense by his post...It's like he said, sometimes, things written on a forum can me taken a thousand different ways... I think he understands that TOR is doing everything it can... I know we all have commitments....hell, you know how long it took my wife to keep me home for a weekend...and I STILL WENT OUT...lol My weekends are busier than my weeks...lol I agree, I don't think Jim meant to offend anyone. I think all he was saying is that we only have 15 members and we have more people volunteering for this project than a club like AZVJC which has thousands of members. I think it is great that we have as many folks volunteering as we do. I understand that folks have other commitments and can't devote all their time to wheeling, there is nothing wrong with that and I don't hold that against them.
|
|
|
Post by azdesertrhino on Sept 27, 2006 7:17:20 GMT -5
Below is a response from someone on one of the other OffRoad groups. This is the attitude I was trying to bring to light. Not the TOR group. Looks like our group will still be supplying the lions share of the labor.
Re: FW: [az_vjc] Volunteer Project Saturday morning 9-30-06 Florence Posted by: "TATE BEN R" brtate@srpnet.com noonecode Tue Sep 26, 2006 10:37 am (PST) Just now reading the emails regarding this. Quoted from someone else's previous email...
"I suspect Francisco is just looking for some mules to do the labor and that is all. regardless, I usually sleep in on Saturdays so I'm prepping an excuse.
|
|
|
Post by azdesertrhino on Sept 27, 2006 7:25:27 GMT -5
After re-reading your last post, I know you are referring to the "1000s of other 4 wheelers," and is not directed to this board, in particular. However, I couldn't help but take a little offense to your original posts. Yea, and this from a guy using his own wedding as an excuse not to show up!! (NOTE HERE: just kidding) Again, my comments were not directed to this group and even after I reread my own post I feel I could have done a much better job putting my thoughts in to words.
|
|
|
Post by zjeep on Sept 27, 2006 7:25:31 GMT -5
That is pretty F'dd up for someone who supposively is a true wheeler and wants to keep trails open here in AZ. I know you wernt trying to offend anyone Jim so dont worry about it. I will be at the cleanup so ill see you all that are going.
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 27, 2006 8:17:17 GMT -5
Below is a response from someone on one of the other OffRoad groups. This is the attitude I was trying to bring to light. Not the TOR group. Looks like our group will still be supplying the lions share of the labor. Re: FW: [az_vjc] Volunteer Project Saturday morning 9-30-06 Florence Posted by: "TATE BEN R" brtate@srpnet.com noonecode Tue Sep 26, 2006 10:37 am (PST) Just now reading the emails regarding this. Quoted from someone else's previous email... "I suspect Francisco is just looking for some mules to do the labor and that is all. regardless, I usually sleep in on Saturdays so I'm prepping an excuse.That response from the AZVJC member is called integrity boys and girls, or should I say...LACK OF INTEGRITY.... in‧teg‧ri‧ty /ɪnˈtɛgrɪti/ –noun 1. adherence to moral and ethical principles; soundness of moral character; honesty. 2. the state of being whole, entire, or undiminished: to preserve the integrity of the empire. 3. a sound, unimpaired, or perfect condition: the integrity of a ship's hull. I'd be curious to find out who the turd is that posted that originally... What a f'tard... I know that we cannot all make it to the project and that we all have weekend commitments from time to time, but TOR as a group has alot of integrity, and we are all good folks. If I've got something to do, and I tell everyone, thats it, thats what I'm doing.... I don't make excuses...
|
|
|
Post by ecameron87 on Sept 27, 2006 8:42:37 GMT -5
OK, I am no longer "butt-hurt".... I just wish I could go. If anyone has another "off-road" related project I could take these scouts on, I think they would enjoy it a lot!
|
|
|
Post by rocktoy on Sept 27, 2006 11:46:09 GMT -5
I want to thank everyone that's going to the cleanup this Saturday. Unfortunately, it's the same day as my daughter's bridal shower.....and I'd have hell to pay if I didn't go. Francisco dropped me an email earlier this week and thanked me for hooking him up with Jim. He thought is was a great effort and was very grateful for any volunteers that would come out. He has two other projects he wants me to look at. Hopefully we'll get the same response from the club for those. These are a little different because it would only be our club participating. I'll have more info at the next meeting.
Again, thank you everyone for your efforts!! I'm proud to call myself a member of your club!!
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 27, 2006 12:18:05 GMT -5
OK, I am no longer "butt-hurt".... I just wish I could go. If anyone has another "off-road" related project I could take these scouts on, I think they would enjoy it a lot! I think we should take your scouts out wheeling and go Shnipe hunting...LOL HAHAHAHAH Seriously, I can think of a few things to help get your group involved in....
|
|
|
Post by dragon51 on Sept 27, 2006 13:08:45 GMT -5
Lol there is a such thing as snipe hunting in AZ it's a type of bird, I found that funny! SNIPE Snipes are small game birds belonging to the SANDPIPER family, Scolopacidae. They measure 28 cm (11 in) in length and have long, straight bills. Their mottled brown-and-white plumage blends well with their wetlands cover, and they have a swift, zigzag flight. The common snipe, Capella gallinago, of both the Old and New Worlds, is the only species regularly found in North America. Some similarly long-billed birds also are colloquially called snipe, including the American woodcock and the dowitchers, of New World beaches and mudflats.
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 27, 2006 13:28:54 GMT -5
Lol there is a such thing as snipe hunting in AZ it's a type of bird, I found that funny! SNIPE Snipes are small game birds belonging to the SANDPIPER family, Scolopacidae. They measure 28 cm (11 in) in length and have long, straight bills. Their mottled brown-and-white plumage blends well with their wetlands cover, and they have a swift, zigzag flight. The common snipe, Capella gallinago, of both the Old and New Worlds, is the only species regularly found in North America. Some similarly long-billed birds also are colloquially called snipe, including the American woodc*ck and the dowitchers, of New World beaches and mudflats. I know that a snipe actually exists, but anyone thats been trough boy scouts as a young boy can recall the shnipe hunt....We were told that Shinpe's ate small children and had large teeth and the only way you could kill it was to poke its eyes out...man, what stories those were...Little did we know that the shnipes were actually troop leaders hiding out in the woods...good times..
|
|
|
Post by 7Lbar on Sept 27, 2006 16:16:57 GMT -5
That brings back memories.
|
|
|
Post by Archangel on Sept 27, 2006 16:53:11 GMT -5
That brings back memories. I'm glad someone knows what it means to go "shnipe" hunting...lol...guess its only a thing with scouts...... I've been lucky enough to be the hunter and the shnipe...
|
|
|
Post by ecameron87 on Sept 27, 2006 18:27:51 GMT -5
I remember my first "snipe" hunt. We were told to look for little red eyes. We were camping at Madera Canyon. We worked ourselves up to get scared. One of us shined a flashlight onto a Racoon and when its eyes lit up from it, we all nearly messed our drawers from being so scared. The leaders got a good laugh out of that.
|
|