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Post by bigredxj on Feb 12, 2007 23:29:36 GMT -5
The Renix system needs 2 reference points to give the right injector sequence - one is the CPS, which you said you replaced, and second is the sync signal generator inside the distributor. If that's not working, you wouldn't be getting the injectors to fire off. Any other ECU inputs just modify the injector pulse width.
The right diagnostic scan tool you'd need to read the ECU live (the Renix doesn't store fault codes) is the DRB 2. I've seen them on eBay a couple times, usually $300-$400.
Hope this helps!
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Post by 7Lbar on Feb 13, 2007 1:50:31 GMT -5
If your CPS is on the front of the engine. Check the clearance between the sensor and the vibration damper. It should be between 0.020" and 0.060" if it is not you get the symptoms you are describing. Had the same problem awhile ago when I converted my YJ from a 4.2L to a 4.0L.
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seeulater
Trail Duster
I wonder what goes through his mind when he sees us peeing in his water bowl.
Posts: 162
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Post by seeulater on Feb 13, 2007 15:26:42 GMT -5
I find this online. don't know if it will help.
.0L No-Start, Hard Restart, or Engine Die-Out. Vehicles Equipped With Automatic Transmission Only.
Index: DRIVEABILITY
Date: December 29, 1989 No.: 18-57-89 (C18-23-9) P-14 Body Code Legend: MJ - COMANCHE (RWD, 4WD) XJ - CHEROKEE/WAGONEER (RWD, 4WD)
SYMPTOM/CONDITION: Some 1989 vehicles equipped with the 4.0L engine and automatic transmission may experience an engine no-start, hard restart, or an engine die-out. This condition may be caused by low signal strength from the crank position sensor due to a larger than desired distance to the flywheel sensing ring.
DIAGNOSIS:
Check to see if the vehicle has a slotted crank position sensor:
If the vehicle is equipped with a slotted crank position sensor (see Figure 1), check to see if the CPS grommet on the top of the transmission bell housing has been updated (see Figure 2). If the CPS grommet has not been updated, replace the CPS grommet per the Repair Procedure outlined below. If the vehicle has a slotted crank position sensor and new CPS grommet, do not install a new sensor, but reinstall the slotted sensor that was on the vehicle and verify that it is good using procedures in the 1989 Jeep Service Manual 81-370-9045 on page 14-87.
If the vehicle does not have a slotted crank position sensor already installed, then proceed with the Repair Procedure. PARTS REQUIRED: 1 Crank Position Sensor (slotted) P/N 83100067 1 Crank Position Sensor Grommet P/N 83100068
REPAIR PROCEDURE:
Turn the ignition switch to the "OFF" position. Disconnect the Crank Position Sensor (CPS) from the engine harness. Raise the vehicle using a lift. Remove the old CPS and grommet. Install the new CPS grommet. NOTE: THE NEW CPS GROMMET MUST BE REPLACED SO THAT THE MAXIMUM SIGNAL OUTPUT CAN BE OBTAINED FROM THE NEW CRANK POSITION SENSOR.
Install the new Crank Position Sensor and loosely attach the retaining bolts. Firmly press down on the slotted hole side of the CPS until it bottoms on the machined lip of the bellhousing. While holding the CPS down against the bellhousing, tighten the bolt on the slotted side of the CPS to 16 ft.lbs. Tighten the remaining attaching bolt to 16 ft.lbs. NOTE: MAKE CERTAIN THAT THE CRANK POSITION SENSOR IS COMPLETELY BOTTOMED ON THE MACHINED LIP OF THE BELLHOUSING AND IS AS CLOSE AS POSSIBLE TO THE FLYWHEEL SENSING RING WITHOUT CONTACTING IT.
Secure the lead of the CPS to the retaining clip on the bellhousing to prevent its contact with the exhaust manifold. Lower the vehicle. Connect the CPS to the engine harness. If this repair has been made, or hasn't fixed the problem, the other TSB is 18-54-89 REVISION A recommending cleaning of the throttle body assembly, DIY: Cleaning Throttle Bodies, and replacement of the PCM.
PARTS REQUIRED: 1 ECU (Automatic Transmission) P/N 53007842 1 ECU (Manual Transmission) P/N 53007843 1 Mopar Choke and Linkage Cleaner P/N 4549619
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Post by 7Lbar on Feb 13, 2007 15:43:29 GMT -5
I find this online. don't know if it will help. .0L No-Start, Hard Restart, or Engine Die-Out. Vehicles Equipped With Automatic Transmission Only. Index: DRIVEABILITY Date: December 29, 1989 No.: 18-57-89 (C18-23-9) P-14 Body Code Legend: MJ - COMANCHE (RWD, 4WD) XJ - CHEROKEE/WAGONEER (RWD, 4WD) SYMPTOM/CONDITION: Some 1989 vehicles equipped with the 4.0L engine and automatic transmission may experience an engine no-start, hard restart, or an engine die-out. This condition may be caused by low signal strength from the crank position sensor due to a larger than desired distance to the flywheel sensing ring. DIAGNOSIS: Check to see if the vehicle has a slotted crank position sensor: If the vehicle is equipped with a slotted crank position sensor (see Figure 1), check to see if the CPS grommet on the top of the transmission bell housing has been updated (see Figure 2). If the CPS grommet has not been updated, replace the CPS grommet per the Repair Procedure outlined below. If the vehicle has a slotted crank position sensor and new CPS grommet, do not install a new sensor, but reinstall the slotted sensor that was on the vehicle and verify that it is good using procedures in the 1989 Jeep Service Manual 81-370-9045 on page 14-87. If the vehicle does not have a slotted crank position sensor already installed, then proceed with the Repair Procedure. PARTS REQUIRED: 1 Crank Position Sensor (slotted) P/N 83100067 1 Crank Position Sensor Grommet P/N 83100068 REPAIR PROCEDURE: Turn the ignition switch to the "OFF" position. Disconnect the Crank Position Sensor (CPS) from the engine harness. Raise the vehicle using a lift. Remove the old CPS and grommet. Install the new CPS grommet. NOTE: THE NEW CPS GROMMET MUST BE REPLACED SO THAT THE MAXIMUM SIGNAL OUTPUT CAN BE OBTAINED FROM THE NEW CRANK POSITION SENSOR. Install the new Crank Position Sensor and loosely attach the retaining bolts. Firmly press down on the slotted hole side of the CPS until it bottoms on the machined lip of the bellhousing. While holding the CPS down against the bellhousing, tighten the bolt on the slotted side of the CPS to 16 ft.lbs. Tighten the remaining attaching bolt to 16 ft.lbs. NOTE: MAKE CERTAIN THAT THE CRANK POSITION SENSOR IS COMPLETELY BOTTOMED ON THE MACHINED LIP OF THE BELLHOUSING AND IS AS CLOSE AS POSSIBLE TO THE FLYWHEEL SENSING RING WITHOUT CONTACTING IT. Secure the lead of the CPS to the retaining clip on the bellhousing to prevent its contact with the exhaust manifold. Lower the vehicle. Connect the CPS to the engine harness. If this repair has been made, or hasn't fixed the problem, the other TSB is 18-54-89 REVISION A recommending cleaning of the throttle body assembly, DIY: Cleaning Throttle Bodies, and replacement of the PCM. PARTS REQUIRED: 1 ECU (Automatic Transmission) P/N 53007842 1 ECU (Manual Transmission) P/N 53007843 1 Mopar Choke and Linkage Cleaner P/N 4549619 Looks like you could adjust the position of the CPS if it is on the bellhousing too. Good find Heather.
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Post by ssii on Feb 13, 2007 19:44:23 GMT -5
I find this online. don't know if it will help. .0L No-Start, Hard Restart, or Engine Die-Out. Vehicles Equipped With Automatic Transmission Only. Index: DRIVEABILITY Date: December 29, 1989 No.: 18-57-89 (C18-23-9) P-14 Body Code Legend: MJ - COMANCHE (RWD, 4WD) XJ - CHEROKEE/WAGONEER (RWD, 4WD) SYMPTOM/CONDITION: Some 1989 vehicles equipped with the 4.0L engine and automatic transmission may experience an engine no-start, hard restart, or an engine die-out. This condition may be caused by low signal strength from the crank position sensor due to a larger than desired distance to the flywheel sensing ring. DIAGNOSIS: Check to see if the vehicle has a slotted crank position sensor: If the vehicle is equipped with a slotted crank position sensor (see Figure 1), check to see if the CPS grommet on the top of the transmission bell housing has been updated (see Figure 2). If the CPS grommet has not been updated, replace the CPS grommet per the Repair Procedure outlined below. If the vehicle has a slotted crank position sensor and new CPS grommet, do not install a new sensor, but reinstall the slotted sensor that was on the vehicle and verify that it is good using procedures in the 1989 Jeep Service Manual 81-370-9045 on page 14-87. If the vehicle does not have a slotted crank position sensor already installed, then proceed with the Repair Procedure. PARTS REQUIRED: 1 Crank Position Sensor (slotted) P/N 83100067 1 Crank Position Sensor Grommet P/N 83100068 REPAIR PROCEDURE: Turn the ignition switch to the "OFF" position. Disconnect the Crank Position Sensor (CPS) from the engine harness. Raise the vehicle using a lift. Remove the old CPS and grommet. Install the new CPS grommet. NOTE: THE NEW CPS GROMMET MUST BE REPLACED SO THAT THE MAXIMUM SIGNAL OUTPUT CAN BE OBTAINED FROM THE NEW CRANK POSITION SENSOR. Install the new Crank Position Sensor and loosely attach the retaining bolts. Firmly press down on the slotted hole side of the CPS until it bottoms on the machined lip of the bellhousing. While holding the CPS down against the bellhousing, tighten the bolt on the slotted side of the CPS to 16 ft.lbs. Tighten the remaining attaching bolt to 16 ft.lbs. NOTE: MAKE CERTAIN THAT THE CRANK POSITION SENSOR IS COMPLETELY BOTTOMED ON THE MACHINED LIP OF THE BELLHOUSING AND IS AS CLOSE AS POSSIBLE TO THE FLYWHEEL SENSING RING WITHOUT CONTACTING IT. Secure the lead of the CPS to the retaining clip on the bellhousing to prevent its contact with the exhaust manifold. Lower the vehicle. Connect the CPS to the engine harness. If this repair has been made, or hasn't fixed the problem, the other TSB is 18-54-89 REVISION A recommending cleaning of the throttle body assembly, DIY: Cleaning Throttle Bodies, and replacement of the PCM. PARTS REQUIRED: 1 ECU (Automatic Transmission) P/N 53007842 1 ECU (Manual Transmission) P/N 53007843 1 Mopar Choke and Linkage Cleaner P/N 4549619 Looks like you could adjust the position of the CPS if it is on the bellhousing too. Good find Heather. You know, that sensor has been an issue for years on those Jeeps. That sensor used to cost about $70.00 years ago and it was highly recomended to carry a spare with you.
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Post by zulu on Feb 13, 2007 21:15:49 GMT -5
No offense, thats why i like what i own, very easy to trouble shoot. Too many sensors that can go bad, makes for a real headache.
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Post by Archangel on Feb 14, 2007 1:07:20 GMT -5
Well...an update... Found out why I had no spark...the CPS I bought from Checker had a pre-existing crack I didn't notice, and the sensor was damaged...go figure... So, I have remedied that problem, but I still have no fuel. I was doing some research on the Renix fuel injection system, and basically, what I discovered is that the injectors fire just as the spark plugs do, in a sequence controlled by the ECU. Now, the two sensors that control the "timing" of these sequences is the CPS and the Sync Generator also known as the stator in the distributor. This document I found is over 100 pages long and its from Jeep FSM's. After reading it, I believe that this could be the problem. If the stator is bad, it will not tell the injectors to fire, and if the ECU does not see a signal from both sensors, I'll be ordering it tomorrow and hopefully have it in before the weekend. Its the only thing left to replace or change. My jeep now has a.. New ECU New Throttle Position Sensor New Crank Position Sensor New Knock Sensor New Ignition Module So, I guess all of the stuff that I swapped out is now spares...lol I'll give the stator a try. Also, I checked my fuel pressure with a brand new gauge (not a rented one) and it shows it dead on the money for a renix system...39 Lbs, and after a 30 min leakdown test, it only drops to 31...well within specs.
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Post by trebor on Feb 14, 2007 1:50:27 GMT -5
No offense, thats why i like what i own, very easy to trouble shoot. Too many sensors that can go bad, makes for a real headache. Amen brother
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Post by Archangel on Feb 18, 2007 0:22:55 GMT -5
Well...after several hours (Since 2 this afternoon) with scanners and all, and chasing that f'ing gremlin... The status is... Sniper still has no pulse. It's still f'ing dead. Anyone need a YJ? I'm going to go read my FSM on Jeep fuel injection...again.
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zj95
Tail Gunner
Im not arrogant...... Im just better than you...
Posts: 276
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Post by zj95 on Feb 18, 2007 0:48:25 GMT -5
my buddy is haveing the same problem with his camero so he took it to a mechanic and found out the the wireing that goes from the ecu to the injectors is shorting out because it was near the block and melted...
im not sure how the wireing is laid out but it might be as simple as that...
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Post by trebor on Feb 18, 2007 1:47:18 GMT -5
Well...after several hours (Since 2 this afternoon) with scanners and all, and chasing that f'ing gremlin... The status is... Sniper still has no pulse. It's still f'ing dead. Anyone need a YJ? I'm going to go read my FSM on Jeep fuel injection...again. I hope ya get a break soon.
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Post by Archangel on Feb 21, 2007 23:34:08 GMT -5
Still no luck. Over the past couple of nights, I've been going through each circuit and sensor. Found my Coolant Temp Sensor was out of specs, so I replaced it, but still no fire. All circuits check out, except one. I am supposed to have 5.0 volts at the distributor, but I only have 3.4 volts...something screwy there. I figure thats my problem, but now I have to find where the voltage is missing... Anyway, back to reading the manual some more...as of right now, Sniper is still down...
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Post by zjeep on Feb 22, 2007 12:01:32 GMT -5
James i hope you get the rig up and running soon
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Post by dragon51 on Feb 22, 2007 13:57:04 GMT -5
Dam Bro I can't believe that it's still dead, wish there was something I could do, with all the help you have done.
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Post by bigazxj on Feb 22, 2007 19:47:06 GMT -5
i have the factory scan tool "drb 2" if you do have the connections for it they would have been on the pass. fender well on the xj with yellow covers on them. ill pm you my cell number.
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Post by rstep on Feb 26, 2007 8:32:07 GMT -5
Any updates James were you able to get time on it this weekend?
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Post by 7Lbar on Feb 26, 2007 11:36:24 GMT -5
Any updates James were you able to get time on it this weekend? or is it time for a Car-B-Q?
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Post by dragon51 on Feb 26, 2007 16:14:40 GMT -5
Well James, I have not seen any proof that your Jeep is moving under it's own power no winch strap or video editing, where they at? Or at least any mention that your Jeep is even fixed. So as Austin stated is it time for a Car-B-Q or would that be a Jeep-B-Q
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Post by rocktoy on Feb 26, 2007 16:45:17 GMT -5
Actually, he's out looking at another jeep today!! His jeep is at my house breathing fresh air and being treated much nicer. He's sitting in a 1955 Willy's on 40" tires and drooling all over the steering wheel as I'm writing this. We'll see what happens!?
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Post by trebor on Feb 26, 2007 16:49:09 GMT -5
Actually, he's out looking at another jeep today!! His jeep is at my house breathing fresh air and being treated much nicer. He's sitting in a 1955 Willy's on 40" tires and drooling all over the steering wheel as I'm writing this. We'll see what happens!? a new jeep.?
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Post by rstep on Feb 26, 2007 19:11:12 GMT -5
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Post by dragon51 on Feb 26, 2007 19:22:58 GMT -5
Yea! Wow? sounds like his Jeep is still not running then
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Post by Archangel on Feb 26, 2007 20:21:34 GMT -5
Yea! Wow? sounds like his Jeep is still not running then Well, as you guessed it...Sniper is still DOA....However, if the chips fall into place, I'll have a kick ass rig by this time tomorrow. Basic specs are as follows.. 1955 Jeep Cj5 Chevy V6 Motor, Griffin Aluminum Radiator, Adjustable Brake Booster 40" Military Tires on 17" Aluminum Rims Ford 9" Rear / D44 Front 5.13 Gears Spooled Front & Rear Locking Hubs On The Front SOA +3" Springs QUarter Eliptical Springs Front & Rear Dual Battery Warn 8274 Hydraulic Assist Steering On Board Air etc.etc.etc.... If things go the way I am hoping, Sniper will be sold very soon. I'll get it running first, so if anyone is interested in my YJ, it may become available.
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Post by dragon51 on Feb 26, 2007 21:29:19 GMT -5
Nice! Very nice ;D
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Post by Archangel on Feb 26, 2007 21:31:18 GMT -5
Here is a pic of the CJ on the Gap... And a pic of it on Chvia
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Post by zjeep on Feb 26, 2007 21:37:34 GMT -5
Why you getting a new vehicle???
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Post by slick1100 on Feb 26, 2007 21:42:30 GMT -5
Can't believe you're bailing on the Heep after all that went into it. Hope it works out for you.
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Post by azdesertrhino on Feb 26, 2007 21:45:42 GMT -5
how much is a dead Jeep going for these days?? ;D
Give me a holler,
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Post by dragon51 on Feb 26, 2007 22:09:39 GMT -5
Now I see it James I am tired hit the wrong button
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Post by trebor on Feb 26, 2007 22:10:52 GMT -5
Yea! Wow? sounds like his Jeep is still not running then Well, as you guessed it...Sniper is still DOA....However, if the chips fall into place, I'll have a kick ass rig by this time tomorrow. Basic specs are as follows.. 1955 Jeep Cj5 Chevy V6 Motor, Griffin Aluminum Radiator, Adjustable Brake Booster 40" Military Tires on 17" Aluminum Rims Ford 9" Rear / D44 Front 5.13 Gears Spooled Front & Rear Locking Hubs On The Front SOA +3" Springs QUarter Eliptical Springs Front & Rear Dual Battery Warn 8274 Hydraulic Assist Steering On Board Air etc.etc.etc.... If things go the way I am hoping, Sniper will be sold very soon. I'll get it running first, so if anyone is interested in my YJ, it may become available. Awesome jeep James.Chevy power.Looks like a mean machine.Is it street legal?If not you going to trailer it to the trail heads.It seems sad to get rid of your yj with all the work you put into it and history you have with it.,but i understand trading up.
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